An odd newbie imparticular.. - Page 3

**FunkyRes** · 04-20-08, 12:35 PM

Originally Posted by Snowberry

Last but not least, he is a hatchling(? (slightly over a foot)) of normal coloration and I paid $120 for him. Only afterward did I learn that I overpaid a little, but I could care less right now. He hates me, but I love him!

Just a note - pet store prices are always higher than breeder or show prices, and that is justifiable - it is costly to run and staff a retail operation. So don't feel like you were ripped off.

He'll calm down for you as you handle him more and more.
I personally let the nasty snakes bite me - as I think it helps them figure out that biting isn't going to make me put them down.

Wear a long sleeve shirt and gloves if you are scared. Small snake bites though generally are relatively painless.

Snowberry · 04-23-08, 03:44 PM

Doesn't look painful, but still looks scarey!

Last night I put one of our four breeding mice in there. This one was a male that wouldn't breed, so I don't have a use for him. I know a sub-adult mouse is big prey for a young ball, but he's no larger than the widest point of the snake, so I thought it might work. After two hours of being in the tank (with the snake following him) the mouse was still not eaten. I took him out and put him back in his little cage.
But now I am concerned that my snake can't eat the mouse. He won't eat anything if it isn't moving, so I am afraid that if I kill the mouse, I am screwed until May 10 when my first pinkie litter is anticipated.
Having not eaten since a few days before I got him, will my snake live until then?? Or should I continue urging him to eat this big mouse?
Frozen pinkies are an hour's drive away and I don't have a license, so don't suggest that because it can't happen..
I have an issue with watching snakes eat, and it isn't because of a grossout factor, its pity for the mouse.

Would it be acceptable to leave the mouse in with the snake unattended, or am I running a huge risk if I try it?
Prompt responses greatly appreciated, any advice appreciated as well...

**FunkyRes** · 04-23-08, 03:55 PM

Never leave a live rodent unattended with a snake. Ever.
They will chew the hell out of the snake often resulting in death.

If the snake is going to eat, it will grab it within the first 10 minutes.

Try again in a few days.

**FunkyRes** · 04-23-08, 03:56 PM

Oh - and after a few feedings, your sensitivity to watching the constriction will be gone and you won't mind watching it.

**FireDrake** · 04-24-08, 01:08 PM

Dont worry about the ball starving... I had one baby fresh from the egg not eat a single thing for almost 3 months, then one day she started eating and is just fine. I have an adult who last year did not eat for 9 months... it happens. THis is exactly why I never recommend balls as first snakes. Dont get me wrong they are wonderful snakes, and make great pets, but it ALWAYS freaks new owners out when any snake doest eat for them, and ball pythons are notorious for doing it, especially if they are not well started captive bred babies, which petstore balls are not...usually.

Another thing, pinkies are too small for even hatchling ball pythons, sure they might eat them but it's just a tid bit compared to what they can handle... so an almost adult mouse is ok IMHO to feed if the snake will eat it. I think most ball breeders use at least mouse fuzzies or hoppers or the equivilent sized rats to start balls, and at least one big breeder I know of starts them on weaning mice almost immediately. In my *limited* experience with the balls I raised this summer, most of them have tackled adult mice no problem at just 60 to 70 grams....(but I usually feed rat pups)

Hope that helps, have fun with your new baby!!

Sarah

Originally Posted by Snowberry

Doesn't look painful, but still looks scarey!

Last night I put one of our four breeding mice in there. This one was a male that wouldn't breed, so I don't have a use for him. I know a sub-adult mouse is big prey for a young ball, but he's no larger than the widest point of the snake, so I thought it might work. After two hours of being in the tank (with the snake following him) the mouse was still not eaten. I took him out and put him back in his little cage.
But now I am concerned that my snake can't eat the mouse. He won't eat anything if it isn't moving, so I am afraid that if I kill the mouse, I am screwed until May 10 when my first pinkie litter is anticipated.
Having not eaten since a few days before I got him, will my snake live until then?? Or should I continue urging him to eat this big mouse?
Frozen pinkies are an hour's drive away and I don't have a license, so don't suggest that because it can't happen..
I have an issue with watching snakes eat, and it isn't because of a grossout factor, its pity for the mouse.

Would it be acceptable to leave the mouse in with the snake unattended, or am I running a huge risk if I try it?
Prompt responses greatly appreciated, any advice appreciated as well...

Snowberry · 04-24-08, 04:09 PM

Thankyou, thankyou, thankyou for the speedy replies!!

I had heard a few horror stories of prey injuring predators, so I wasn't too sure. I tried feeding him in a smaller container and he just got scared and rolled up tightly while the mouse was cruising around. I've been offering him the mouse atleast once every day (and its the same mouse) and he usually follows it around, but rarely strikes at it, and he has never grabbed it or attempted to constrict it.

I guess only time will tell? I'm hoping eventually that his appetite will get the best of him.
I have heard a few times that a ball can go a year without eating, but I really don't want to stunt his growth at such a tender age. It could have damaging mental and physical effects.

He sure is a cavebat, though! He never comes out of his little rock shelter. By the way, he STILL has not shed all of his skin, so I've been bathing him in a 1-5 oil/water mixture to try to ease the skin off. I usually set him in the pan while I watch TV until he starts to get squirmy (15-40 mins) and then I dry him off lightly and put him back.
At what point should I seak medical treatment for this? I can't tell when his eyes are clear/capped because they've looked the same since I got him.

**FireDrake** · 04-24-08, 05:46 PM

Dont try every day, that stresses them out. Every 3-4 days at minimum, me, if one of mine doesnt eat, they have to wait 10 more days till I feed again. Also while you are in the process of trying to get the shed off, dont expect it to eat at all, any and all handling stresses them out as well. IN fact, I would not handle or even look at the snake for five days or so, THEN try to feed it again, and do it at night. Dont worry about stunting it's growth, reptile growth depends on amount of food, not by age.

Here's my tried and true method of getting stuck shed to come off:

Get a pillowcase, preferably flannel and a terry cloth hand or dishtowel. Soak them in the hottest water you can get from the tap (trust me on this) and then wring them both out as much as possible, till they are not dripping... by this time they are cool enough. Place the towel inside the pillowcase and put the snake in there too... loosely close the pillowcase by twisting it (I never put knots in them when I do this) and make sure it's all a nice loose pile, place somewhere where you can watch it or at the bottom of a bucket or something in case the snake does get out (I've never once had an escape this way, knock on wood, even when I have forgotten them for a few minutes or left the room) in the process of the snake slithering around in the warm, moist pillowcase it rubs against the towel and sides and the shed often comes right off. Every once in a while I've had a few with really stuborn patches, with these I use the terry cloth towel on my hand, close it around the snake above where the skin is, tight enoug that the snake is pushing, but loose enough that it can easily slither, and hold on to the snake and let it slide through the towel and your hand, this will often snag an edge of the shed and peel it right off.

My adult balls all have hides with moist moss in them... the young balls are in a rack that holds in humidity better so I dont use moss on them, but that helps the skin stay nice and healthy so they dont have the bad shed in the first place.

Sarah

Originally Posted by Snowberry

Thankyou, thankyou, thankyou for the speedy replies!!

I had heard a few horror stories of prey injuring predators, so I wasn't too sure. I tried feeding him in a smaller container and he just got scared and rolled up tightly while the mouse was cruising around. I've been offering him the mouse atleast once every day (and its the same mouse) and he usually follows it around, but rarely strikes at it, and he has never grabbed it or attempted to constrict it.

I guess only time will tell? I'm hoping eventually that his appetite will get the best of him.
I have heard a few times that a ball can go a year without eating, but I really don't want to stunt his growth at such a tender age. It could have damaging mental and physical effects.

He sure is a cavebat, though! He never comes out of his little rock shelter. By the way, he STILL has not shed all of his skin, so I've been bathing him in a 1-5 oil/water mixture to try to ease the skin off. I usually set him in the pan while I watch TV until he starts to get squirmy (15-40 mins) and then I dry him off lightly and put him back.
At what point should I seak medical treatment for this? I can't tell when his eyes are clear/capped because they've looked the same since I got him.

Snowberry · 04-26-08, 06:04 PM

Oh gosh! I should have known better.
The fact that he's not done shedding could be the reason he wont eat, and it may even have something to do with his striking (which he has virtually stopped already).

I do keep his enclosure very moist, and there is live moss and plants in there with him, but he spends most of his time in his cave, which is raised off the ground to give him a refuge from the moss (to prevent blisters).

It is very hard to believe that sheds come off so easily after I have seen what this one is like. I am starting to think it will never come off! After reading this, I'm going to give Patchy a little vacation. It sounds like its definitely in his best interest. I'll leave him alone for a few days and then we'll get back to business.

That mouse I keep throwing at him now knows exactly what's going to happen when I reach for the cage. He dives underneath his bedding and we play tag for a while. I'm sure the mouse will appreciate the vacation too... Before he becomes mouse-chops!